It sure was nice that I was never exposed to tobacco smoke in the homes of any of my JW family members. It was also nice (at least since the year I was born) that smoking never took place inside a Kingdom Hall building.
Disillusioned JW
JoinedPosts by Disillusioned JW
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27
What aspects do you view most favorably about the WT and/or its religion?
by Disillusioned JW ineven if you disapprove of much about the wt and/or its religion, what aspects do you view most favorably about the wt and/or its religion?
for me one of the things i view most favorably about the wt and its religion is its extremely strong insistence that jws never intentionally kill another human being.
i especially appreciate that regarding those who have been born, but i think some abortions of human embryos might be justifiable.
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Disillusioned JW
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What aspects do you view most favorably about the WT and/or its religion?
by Disillusioned JW ineven if you disapprove of much about the wt and/or its religion, what aspects do you view most favorably about the wt and/or its religion?
for me one of the things i view most favorably about the wt and its religion is its extremely strong insistence that jws never intentionally kill another human being.
i especially appreciate that regarding those who have been born, but i think some abortions of human embryos might be justifiable.
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Disillusioned JW
I agree that smoking and using illicit drugs is very bad for health, but I believe full Covid-19 vaccination for the vast majority of people is far more beneficial for them than harmful for them. I have received two full doses of Moderna's vaccination and I am glad for that, despite the discomfort I felt from both doses (especially from the latter dose).
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Do You Think Trump Will Make A Comeback?
by minimus indo you think he could get reinstated as president?
do you think trump will run again for president or do you think he will just be a force for the republican party behind the scenes?.
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Disillusioned JW
No (regarding him obtaining federal elected office), since he is in over his head with lawsuits against him and/or some of his organizations. I hope he never ever again becomes elected to government office in the USA!
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What aspects do you view most favorably about the WT and/or its religion?
by Disillusioned JW ineven if you disapprove of much about the wt and/or its religion, what aspects do you view most favorably about the wt and/or its religion?
for me one of the things i view most favorably about the wt and its religion is its extremely strong insistence that jws never intentionally kill another human being.
i especially appreciate that regarding those who have been born, but i think some abortions of human embryos might be justifiable.
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Disillusioned JW
Even if you disapprove of much about the WT and/or its religion, what aspects do you view most favorably about the WT and/or its religion? For me one of the things I view most favorably about the WT and its religion is its extremely strong insistence that JWs never intentionally kill another human being. I especially appreciate that regarding those who have been born, but I think some abortions of human embryos might be justifiable. Another thing that I really appreciate about WT and its religion is their requirement that JWs must not join any military. The WT has created an organization consisting of millions of people who have those values. That is an impressive and very honorable feat.
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Why dont practicing JWS cant accept the fact that the Watchtower Corporation is a commercialized false prophet ?
by Finkelstein into the majority of people who investigate the activities of the wts from its beginning history there were obvious false proclamations and doctrines propagated by the wts.. a matter of fact the wts produced a long list of literature that posted proclamations on the front cover and went into detail of things that were suppose to happen, from jesus returning changing the world in which we live and so on.. wonderful things one might say but not factual or either theologically correct .
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Disillusioned JW
I just know (have intense conviction) that active JWs knew the WT was not selling the literature for a profit, thus it is shocking to me to that any person who had been an active JW would sincerely say the WT had been selling literature.
I've already stated my comments about whether or not I think past leaders of the WTS/JWs were false prophets (and regarding their intentions), and I thus see no reason to answer a question again about that matter.
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Why dont practicing JWS cant accept the fact that the Watchtower Corporation is a commercialized false prophet ?
by Finkelstein into the majority of people who investigate the activities of the wts from its beginning history there were obvious false proclamations and doctrines propagated by the wts.. a matter of fact the wts produced a long list of literature that posted proclamations on the front cover and went into detail of things that were suppose to happen, from jesus returning changing the world in which we live and so on.. wonderful things one might say but not factual or either theologically correct .
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Disillusioned JW
By the time (or shortly after) the WT started offering DVDs they had stopped asking for a specific contribution amount for them and all other items. [They still asked for contributions for them, for several years, but they had stopped stating a specific amount. Except, I remember one overseer (and/or a KM) saying when making a contribution to keep in mind how much similar products cost (namely those sold by for profit businesses).] Furthermore, cassette packages and DVDs have production costs. I don't specifically recall them being advertised on the back pages of WT literature, though I know that books were.
I have no disagreement with the accusations of "the pressure and deliberate persuasion of transferring over building and land Titles of Kingdom Halls", hence I did not say those accusations were false.
I don't bother to make posts about every action (bad or good) the WT does.
If by "on the fence about this religion" you mean I am not sure whether or not to stay out of the religion, you are wrong. I desire to never again become active in the religion. I am an atheist and I won't become a theist again (unless perhaps I loose my mind). If the religion ever ends its shunning policy of ex-JWs in regards to their JW family members, I will immediately officially disassociate from the religion. I see many flaws with the religion, but that doesn't mean I think there is nothing good about it. It also doesn't mean I think they are dishonest in everything they said, instead I see they were dishonest in many things and honest in many more things they said. If you mean I am hesitant to get rid of all of the WT literature I have, then in that respect you are correct. I appreciate some of their literature, to varying degrees, whereas I have extremely low appreciation for most of their other literature.
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Why dont practicing JWS cant accept the fact that the Watchtower Corporation is a commercialized false prophet ?
by Finkelstein into the majority of people who investigate the activities of the wts from its beginning history there were obvious false proclamations and doctrines propagated by the wts.. a matter of fact the wts produced a long list of literature that posted proclamations on the front cover and went into detail of things that were suppose to happen, from jesus returning changing the world in which we live and so on.. wonderful things one might say but not factual or either theologically correct .
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Disillusioned JW
Rocketman123 you sure do have a foul mouth, calling me an a***** - or should I say "foul hands" instead of "foul mouth" since you typed the word instead of spoke it.
Furthermore, that post you are referring to doesn't name you, but I guess you recognize the shoe fits you (figuratively speaking), since trying on the shoe (figuratively speaking). Prior to my post in this topic thread you hadn't even made a post in this topic thread, yet you felt I had singled you out. My comment of "How someone who had been a baptized JW could think the WT was about for-profit commercialism of literature is hard for me to comprehend" applies to anyone and everyone in that category, not exclusively you.
I joined the theocratic ministry school and gave my first Bible reading in the Kingdom Hall before the year 1975 (before age 10 and several years before I got baptized), thus I also became active in the WT religion a long time ago. I later had a subscription to the WT and the AW for several years. I obtained much literature and made contributions for them when obtaining the literature - but the literature was not sold to me. The contributions requested for the magazines and books were dirt cheap. The back of a 192-page book (United in Worship, for example) in the year 1983 only asked for a contribution of 75 cents for the 192-page books. That is a dirt cheap price - no room for a net profit to the WT for it. Yet you are saying I am ignorant on this matter. Good grief. In the Kingdom Hall I was a servant in charge of the magazine counter and the literature counter for a number of years. I am thus very aware of the WT asking contributions for the literature and how much was requested for them.
The literature was not SOLD by the WT, instead a contribution/donation was asked for them and usually obtained for them. That is an important distinction I am making. There is a difference between selling for profit as a commercial for-profit business and asking for contributions as a non-profit entity distributing items. You don't seem to see the distinction, but the WT clearly stated to the JWs that a contribution/donation was requested for them. The WT's Our Kingdom Ministry/Service even told publishers that householders could obtain the literature without giving money for it, if they sincerely said they couldn't afford it. (That was stated in at least one issue, and the last time I read it was only about a week ago). As a result, there were times when I gave the WT and AW issues to householders without obtaining a contribution pertaining to them for the WT Society. Yet, you claim to not know that policy, despite claiming to have been a JW. Eventually the WT religion (through JWs in the field) even stopped asking money when offering the literature. These examples show that literature was not being sold! Sometimes I met people (non-JWs) who said the WT/JWs sell literature, but told those people that is not true. I told them that instead a donation/contribution is asked for the items, but if people can't give the money they can still receive the items (at no charge). I also told them that the amount of the requested contribution doesn't produce any net profit, but rather only covers the cost (maybe not even the full cost) of producing the literature.
You won't succeed in intimidating me to get out of this site. I stand up to bullies who imitate the figurative 'father of lies'. Truth is important to me and I hate lies. I thus speak out (and write against) lies, including malicious lies about the WT.
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Remembering Rutherford
by Sea Breeze inhe seems to me to be the angriest and most ill-tempered of all the wt presidents, especially after his stint in prison and failed prophecies.. “regarding his misguided statements as to what we could expect in 1925, he [rutherford] once confessed to us at bethel, “i made an ass of myself.”” watchtower 1984 oct 1 p.24.
rutherford died at beth sarim on january 8, 1942, at the age of 72.
[220] cause of death was...carcinoma of the rectum..."[21] .
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Disillusioned JW
On page 10 of this message topic thread I said "As a result I now believe that the WT, despite being registered as a nonprofit, is commercialized." But now I again say the WT is not commercialized and that I was in error for briefly giving into the idea that the WT is commercialized.
Rocketman123 was incorrect in saying that the "... WTS sold its literature to the public, such as yearly subscriptions to magazines, books, cassette tapes, dvds ..." . Likewise others were incorrect in saying similar things. Though the WT listed a monetary amount for those items and requested donations/contributions for them, they were not selling those items. That is a crucial distinction that needs to be made.
The Qualified to Be Ministers book (1955 edition) on page 354 in paragraph 5 says "The Society is nonprofit and noncommercial ....". I came across statement about two days ago without looking for such a statement (instead I was looking for more information about the WT's history). The WT hasn't sold literature but instead asked for donations/contributions. The donations/contributions that were directly received for literature didn't cover the cost of producing the literature. Furthermore people in the field could obtain the literature without making the contribution, and eventually the WT (and JWs in the field ministry) even stopping asking for contributions in association with offerings of literature. The contribution amounts, such as 75 cents for a 192-page book in 1983, were dirt cheap. It is clear to me that the WT is not about for-profit commercialism of literature, however I have wondered why they produced so many different books, considering that the general message of so many of the books is basically the same. Maybe the main reason for so many different books is to keep the JWs excited about the religion and to keep them reading the literature, as well as attract more people to the religion (by keeping the literature exciting)
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Why dont practicing JWS cant accept the fact that the Watchtower Corporation is a commercialized false prophet ?
by Finkelstein into the majority of people who investigate the activities of the wts from its beginning history there were obvious false proclamations and doctrines propagated by the wts.. a matter of fact the wts produced a long list of literature that posted proclamations on the front cover and went into detail of things that were suppose to happen, from jesus returning changing the world in which we live and so on.. wonderful things one might say but not factual or either theologically correct .
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Disillusioned JW
The Qualified to Be Ministers book (1955 edition) on page 354 in paragraph 5 says "The Society is nonprofit and noncommercial ....". They don't sell literature but instead asked for donations. The donations that were directly received for literature don't cover the cost of producing the literature. The donation amounts such as 75 cents for a 192-page book in 1983 were dirt cheap. How someone who had been a baptized JW could think the WT was about for-profit commercialism of literature is hard for me to comprehend.
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Do you think there is an Omnipotent, Omniscient Being that lives forever and ever?
by pistolpete innotice that i left off "benevolent" .
reason being is because i could argue that being all knowing and all powerful is not a prerequisite of being "good".
yet i'm a firm believer that "something didn't come from nothing".
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Disillusioned JW
Hell no! The only possible exception I can think of is if the universe (or multiverse if there is one) is somehow a conscious being/entity - a type of pantheism (for lack of a better word). But even if the universe (or multiverse) is conscious (maybe in the sense of a colossal quantum computer), its knowledge and its power would not be infinite, though it would contain all of the knowledge and power in existence at any moment of time. The type of pantheism I am speaking of is probably close to Baruch Spinoza's idea/belief that God is the universe (or nature), except I don't think Spinoza thought the universe (or nature) is conscious.
I think the universe, in the fullest sense of the word "universe" (which would be equal to a multiverse if a multiverse exists) has always existed in some form and will always exist in some form. Though I believe/think the universe (that which is currently defined as the universe or a bubble within a multiverse) has expanded in volume tremendously since about 13.8 billion years ago (but with possible adjustments for time dilation when considering a temporal frame of reference), I don't think it was ever a singularity (with zero volume and infinite mass-energy density). The general relativity equations don't work for singularities; instead the equations must be modified for quantum effects (but scientists don't yet know to fully modify them).
Scientists keep looking for an ultimate beginning (or truly fundamental particle, at least as far as I know) but they haven't yet found one and that suggests to me that nature is eternal (and thus never had in intelligent creator/designer). Even when some scientists speak of the universe coming from nothing, they never mean literal nothingness. Instead they mean quantum fluctuations of energy (and maybe also disconnected bits of space and time with no defined alignment or direction) in the so-called void (or in the fabric of space-time), or something like that.